joan warburton 10 Feb 2005

Christina, Sher posted similar views several months ago and initially I agreed with her, then changed my mind after reading the posts of all the good artists that do contribute so much to the site, but are on free memberships.

I was really shocked at the low number of paying members, however. I'm also torn between knowing that it's just a few rude people that ruin it for everyone else and most of the non- paying members are incredible artists, offer their support to everyone and post very positive critiques.

What you say is so true about other websites drawing a more distinct line between paying and non-paying members. In light of the financial problems, employee problems, and bandwidth problems, and knowing what I know now, I definitely have to agree. I'll take the heat with you.

Joe Bartz 10 Feb 2005

I am not taking sides here but I am a free member and have paid out over $120.00 in books and calendars and I plan to buy more. That amount is equivalent to a 2 year premium membership.

Doesn't that count for something?

Volunteer of America 10 Feb 2005

No, it doesn't.--you need to subtract "costs" from the $120, you have "contributed" MAYBE $30 to the NOI. (net operating income)

joan warburton 10 Feb 2005

I think it most certainly does, Joe. That's why I feel so torn over the issue. However, you an exception. You participate, you leave comments, you are a gentleman on this site. The problem is that if there were no paid members, there would not be a site.

If more people are not encouraged to become paid members there's just so much that AW can do, yet paid and unpaid members continually request improvements, more bandwith, quicker answers, quicker responses to problems, etc.

I agree with Christina. There has to be a free membership but there also has to be a higher percentage of paid members than there is now.

Gayla Drummond 10 Feb 2005

AW staff...why the heck don't ya have a donate button for the site? Where those who don't pay to play might toss a couple of dollars your way ever so often, and those that do pay to play can send a little more your way even if they have their membership paid up for a year?

I mean, c'mon on already. =)

Just keep up with the total of donations, and how much goes towards site expenses. Easypeasy!

Joe Bartz 10 Feb 2005

Ignore feature ON: Volunteer of America

I agree with everything you say Joan, I just wanted to throw that out there for discussion because there is more than one way you can contribute to this site.

A donate button is a good idea...I would donate.

Gayla Drummond 10 Feb 2005

Joe, I don't think he was picking at you, just pointing out a fact.

Though, the book's costs were paid by the participating artists for the large part, right?

RQ Trietsch 10 Feb 2005

I've already posted links for the book and told them to AW, to keep the "reward" as a contribution. And wasn't it $35 buy-in into the book...which I have two of.

But bottom line for me is still the same issue dealing with nudity.

I can't post the majority of my first choice of mediums, and until AW changes or fixes that situation I will remain a "freebie" or be exiled, which ever comes first.

Don't forget, there are a lot of free sites out there that aren't PG rated.

So I guess it's the company in here that keeps me coming back in here....omitting you people I don't like...just kidding.

Joe Bartz 10 Feb 2005

The ONLY thing stopping me from becoming a premium member is the fact that I already pay a monthly fee for my own personal art site. If I could donate, then I would because I enjoy this web-site.

Gayla Drummond 10 Feb 2005

I think it was $39, RQ...per page, then the purchase of a copy, or copies, for those who wanted more than one. =)

See, Joe thinks a donation button is a good idea!

Kay L. Schlagel 10 Feb 2005

I agree with Christina. I pay my 5 bucks a month out of a disability check so I can certainly talk from a starving artist's view. I was a freebie for the first couple of months because of not being able to squeeze that 5 bucks out but I really love being on this site and felt that 5 dollars is a pretty inexpensive "gallery fee"

Aaron Wisdom 10 Feb 2005

With all the threads about restrictions to free members there would be nothing left for free members.

Why restrict message board use? I think it can be a great tool for those artists just starting out (Such as forums like Critiques and Tutorials and Tips) who are not ready, or able to pay for the site.

RQ Trietsch 10 Feb 2005

Must be nice to have a guaranteed income.

Just went thru my books and last year was not good!! 1/3 of normal, the joys of being self employed.

I almost made and this is no joke, almost made poverty status, so I have issues i won't go into on this thread.

sher richardson 10 Feb 2005

::waves to Christina::

One thing AW must do is to have the premium members have more control with options, to help a spark of desire for free members to want the goodies also and upgrade...you know that old bells and whistles theory? Trust me it works...

*One thread and thought was to have an option to allow comments only and not ratings from free accounts. Thus eliminating fraudulant accounts from having willy nilly rampages... Thereby the free accounts might wish to upgrade to have more ratings fun...

All 'they' need to do is make the premium accounts more appealing and have more control.

Also as RQ stated, this no nude issue is just bassackwards. But of course some church must be monitoring this site, so in time someone will make a site like this and allow nudes to some degree and lure serious artists from here...

Chatrooms would help also IF it was ONLY for premium members..then more would upgrade..

People need to keep throwing out the ideas.. : )

Thanks Christina!

Gayla Drummond 10 Feb 2005

I have nudes on my website, and you'd be amazed at the number of church websites that have emailed me wanting to exchange links. I point out that I have nude artwork, and they don't care.

It's the BoobnBits police, Sher. =)

ArtWanted.com Staff 10 Feb 2005

It's great to see so much support for the site. It's great to see that people are willing to donate to the pot, to make our site even better. If you guys want a donate button, we will be more than happy to put one up. :-)

We are not quite sure we are sold on the idea of restricting free accounts from the message boards yet. Our biggest fear is that if we did something like this, the message board would become a ghost town except for a little corner of premium members hangin' out at the saloon. It's something to think about.

The whole free/premium issue is a tricky subject. We have to give away some things or we would not have any members, but at the same time, we don't want to give away the farm. We will spend some time evaluating the two accounts based on the comments above and see if changes need to be made. We too would love to see the percentage of 'premium' members increase and have some fun new features coming up for those that support our site with premium memberships.

There are many ways to support our site and every bit of it helps. Premium accounts are the best way, but any purchase of any kind and simply telling others about our site helps too.

Thanks again for your suggestions and support, keep it coming!

sher richardson 10 Feb 2005

You know Gayla, i have forgotten what the explaination was for no nudes or even nudes with nothing showing...

is it because kindergarteners are at school looking at this site for their advanced art classes and seeing blood guts and gore, vampires dripping blood (no offense to vamp artists : ) swastikas and devil images...but heaven forbid they may see the basis of art which is nature and the human form?

Oh i understand that... : )

(sorry, off the thread topic i know)

Gayla Drummond 11 Feb 2005

It was school kiddos viewing the site, Sher. =)

Yes, put up a donate button! I've got a year paid up, but I'll dang sure donate some to this site, because it's been very good to me, as have its members and staff.

While I think more perks for premium members would make more people want to become paying members, I respectfully disagree with taking items away from the free members.

Renderosity used to allow 3 uploads daily to its free members. Because of bandwidth costs, etc, they changed that to one upload daily...if you wanted to keep your 3 daily, you had to pay for membership. This caused big problems for that site, and several artists left that had contributed constantly to the community at large.

It's just not fair to punish the free members, and that's what taking away the things given at sign up will be - punishment.

I know, I know, I jumped on the bandwagon about only letting premium members rate....but that's really not fair, after thinking upon it and remembering what happened at Renderosity when it happened there.

sher richardson 11 Feb 2005

:::I know, I jumped on the bandwagon about only letting premium members rate....but that's really not fair:::

Gayla , what if its an option for each premium member to make on their own convictions? If i pay upfront yearly and wish to protect my work from alias name makers who purge in a very mean way only in a free account, isnt that my right to just allow a comment and not a rating?

Ohwell..i promised myself i wouldnt get involved with the subject... : )

peace hugs and smiles ...

Gayla Drummond 11 Feb 2005

You know Sher, I do see the point in doing it like that...make it an option to only allow premium members to rate your work if you are a premium member. Yeah, that's a good compromise. =)

I guess, on the whole, it's up to the PTB if the code can be implemented to make that possible.